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Kev Spence
Site Admin
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 3:59 pm Posts: 10902 Location: Loughborough, Leics, central UK
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Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Just to confirm this rare tree Euphorbia is quite hardy so far in my garden which has now seen lows to -6.5c and 4 frost days just this year.
I would like to see an updated list of habitat numbers as in 2008 it seems they counted less than 50 mature tree's where it grows in the
I have now planted a Trachelospermum asiaticum "Theta" to scramble up the clear trunk that is now starting to show.
Do we have any others growing this plant if not why not.....lol
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Thu Mar 15, 2018 12:01 pm |
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Paul Spracklin
Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 3:55 pm Posts: 2564 Location: North Thames delta UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Mine is a bit larger but not quite so happy - probably saw -7C - but alive!
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Thu Mar 15, 2018 12:53 pm |
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Kev Spence
Site Admin
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 3:59 pm Posts: 10902 Location: Loughborough, Leics, central UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Do you think yours maybe a little on the dry side Paul considering your location at least ours do not have to compete with Hedychium for a place to grow well.
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Thu Mar 15, 2018 1:07 pm |
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Paul Spracklin
Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 3:55 pm Posts: 2564 Location: North Thames delta UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
I am sure it would grow better with more rainfall - most of my garden would, I suspect - but the current sulking is almost certainly cold-related.
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Thu Mar 15, 2018 1:18 pm |
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neobb
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:17 pm Posts: 582 Location: vancouver, canada
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Hi Kev, Wow! I really like the look of that one! Did you grow it from seed or buy from a nursery? Hope it continues to thrive under your expert care. Thanks!
_________________ Ted
green dream saturated
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Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:02 pm |
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Laurence
Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2018 11:34 am Posts: 1822 Location: Weston- Super- Mare. North Somerset UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Kev,
Nice plant. Do you grow Euphorbia pasteurii or Euphorbia mellifera?. The leaves are similar. I think Euphorbia mellifera is the least frost hardy. That is the one I have. It did not like the extreme cold in early March, but has recovered for now but another spell of cold weather is due..... I normally find that if heavy frost is forecast the plant is cut back, but because of that it does not flower or very few flowers. Has your plant flowered yet?. Maybe a good alternative to Euphorbia mellifera as more hardy and reliable. How big does it get as never seen one?.
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Thu Mar 15, 2018 7:22 pm |
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Kev Spence
Site Admin
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 3:59 pm Posts: 10902 Location: Loughborough, Leics, central UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Hi Ted the plant was a foot high when I planted it in 2013. It was supplied by Mark Fillan a member here whose website I do not seem to be able to find now?
Laurence we have never been lucky enough to visit the Azores where this plant grows so the I am unsure of the eventual height that this plant gets too and I am guessing if their were only 50 left in 2008 they would be a tough spot to find anyway. Paul has been maybe he has an idea?
Euphorbia pasteurii was hopeless here it got trashed here nearly every year having to re-shoot from the base I eventually dispensed with it. This plant has not flowered yet but never say never it certainly has a different habit to other Euphorbia we have grown here. It is placed in a fairly well drained bed and gets no winter sun so I am quite pleased with it.
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Thu Mar 15, 2018 8:02 pm |
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John Jearrard
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 11:19 pm Posts: 487 Location: Cornwall, UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Very miserable in the snow.
Perked up immediately after. Also seems to be remarkably tolerant of wind and exposure.
_________________ John.
www.johnjearrard.co.uk
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Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:22 pm |
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David Matzdorf
Site Admin
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 4:06 pm Posts: 5321 Location: Islington, London UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
The only one of these spp. that I have grown is Euphorbia mellifera and that was over a period of 20 years in two gardens. It's a lot tougher than many people reckon. The reason I no longer have it is that it became enormous - 3.0m across, 2.5m high - and the only way to keep it from devouring London was to cut it back, which - as Laurence says - stops it flowering for a year. So Dave Bindon helped me demolish it in 2008.
I brought it here as a self-sown seedling at my old place, where the original still persists, along with at least six others that my successors there have propagated over the years. They're all over the garden, in all aspects, and many of them have been through multiple hard winters in the mid-'90s and between 2008 and 2011.
The dramatic wilting in freezing temperatures is a self-preservation mechanism - it pumps water out of the cells to prevent ice crystals from damaging the tissues and then perks up as soon as ambient temperatures go above 0ºC.
When Tim Smit & co. unearthed the gardens at Heligan in Cornwall, they found an ancient E. mellifera in what is now the Italian Garden. It was smothered with random climbers, but still alive after decades untended. They cut it down, it shot from the base and, as far as I know, it's still there.
It's a tough shrub that tolerates nearly everything except shade and extreme cold. I'm mystified why it has become rare in habitat.
_________________ 51º33'07"N x 0º07'21"W
43m (142 feet) ASL
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Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:29 am |
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Laurence
Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2018 11:34 am Posts: 1822 Location: Weston- Super- Mare. North Somerset UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
David,
It was interesting to read about your Euphorbia mellifera. Clearly the plant liked your conditions in London. My parents in north Devon have a a young plant that I brought from RHS Rosemoor in 1992 planted between two walls of the neighbouring houses. Being very mild in that part of Devon and only two miles from the sea, the Euphorbia got enormous and have cut it back numerous times. The same height and spread of your Euphorbia before you removed it. It is still planted there, as it is such a good specimen. But I still have to keep under control. Wonder how large it would get if it was left without pruning it ?.. I do know of someone who has a plant near Reading in a rather cold garden. It gets to a max of three feet then gets frosted to the ground and never or rarely flowers. So guess it does not do well everywhere. But I think Kev should try it. In a sheltered spot it might do well.
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Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:03 am |
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Paul Spracklin
Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 3:55 pm Posts: 2564 Location: North Thames delta UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Mark's introduction was the first time it has been cultivated. Comes from just the one island of Santa Maria in a rarely visited and poorly botanised group of islands, growing in sheltered deep gorges and gets to 15m or more with a trunk girth of 60cm. Quite a beast.
I grow a few of these. E. mellifera has been here for 25 years. It was damaged in 2009/10 but regrew from the base, that is the only time it has been worried by the weather - even small seedlings seem oblivious. It self seeds profusely - in summer you can here the capsules pinging seeds around the garden like air gun pellets! I have a tall, upright form of stygiana (but not the Santa Maria form - not sure which island it came from) given to me by Doug Smith that is doing marvellously - if anything it was less bothered by 09/10 than mellifera. I recently planted the more prostate form of stygiana and, additionally, have a couple of forms of x pastuerii (which also self seed around).
I think they are all magnificent things! Perhaps the genus euphorbia should be celebrated on here maybe with a thread dedicated to all the wondrous plants in it?
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Fri Mar 16, 2018 9:04 am |
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Nick Macer
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:42 pm Posts: 1284 Location: Gloucestershire, UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Paul, E. stygiana subsp. santamariae is not that big in the wild. From memory it is about 6m tall with a trunk diameter up to 30cm, so a small tree. E. mellifera forms a small tree on Madeira of course but not sure on exact potential size. I've been to the spot santamariae grows and it's wind and exposure tolerance will be very much down to the fact it grows on sea cliffs! I would suggest that E. stygiana subsp. stygiana would be even more tolerant of sea winds due to the thicker textured more waxy looking foliage. Both my plants of subsp. santamariae flowered last year. It would seem to me from a purely visual and unscientific viewpoint that the latter may be more closely related to E. mellifera than E. stygiana.
E. stygiana subsp. stygiana is definitely hardier than E. mellifera and E. x pasteurii and the latter sits about between the two parents in cold tolerance, which would make sense. Kev, you should try E. x pasteuriii again as you are milder than me and I can generally grow it easily and without damage, though the very coldest winters, no doubt when you tried it first, killed it to the ground each year here for three winters running, ie 2009 and both ends of 2010.
Most E. stygiana in the Azores are of upright bushy form with the low serpentine growth form being, I believe, from one island only. It is purely down to chance that the low serpentine form was introduced first to the UK and spread around in cultivation. There are good specimens of the naturally more common upright form at Glasnevin, Dublin and Brest BG, Brittany.
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Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:00 pm |
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Martinnicklin
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 9:06 pm Posts: 2675 Location: Telford UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Mine is about 6ft tall and 6ft wide with three good thick trunks and a great luxuriant canopy and was doing very well until the ferocious freezing winds and blizzards a few weeks ago did this. Given today's horrendous weather again, I have fleeced it and hope it pulls through. It is a handsome plant indeed.
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Sat Mar 17, 2018 4:14 pm |
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Kev Spence
Site Admin
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 3:59 pm Posts: 10902 Location: Loughborough, Leics, central UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
Interesting to see Martin how cold did you drop too I am guessing as long as the main stems at ground level are not mushy you should be ok.
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Sat Mar 17, 2018 4:53 pm |
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Paul Spracklin
Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 3:55 pm Posts: 2564 Location: North Thames delta UK
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Re: Euphorbia stygiana ssp santamariae
_________________ visit my website - www.oasisdesigns.co.uk
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Sat Mar 17, 2018 8:28 pm |
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